[bendy-timed] Let's Get It All Out [locked to New Hires except Price, Mac, and Jack Spicer]

[credit_not_blame]

[Not too long after some of the New Hires come back from this mess of a mission, a locked down video post appears on the secret network from everyone's favorite still-underaged-shhhh werewolf. She looks perky, in the slightly manic manner of someone gearing up for a fight.]


Since everyone got so excited about my question regarding what we were going to do with the Jorgmund scientists on the last mission, promptly turning it into a seething argument on whether or not killing is ever acceptable, I've decided to bring it up here on the Rig. Because apparently we need to have this conversation now or else we're going to have it at a completely inappropriate time and place; like on a mission where we're trying to plan out how to escape a prison that mind-fucks us.

[Because really, people? Really? Stacia clears her throat and schools her expression back into a smile.]

I'm going to need everyone to shitpost like crazy on the public side of things, because I can't be in charge of that and in charge of moderating this, the hottest of topics.

Speaking of, guess what. I'm in charge of moderating this conversation because Lonestar likes me best. Or because I volunteered; six of one, half dozen of the other. That means that I can freeze your threads and put you in time out if you break the rules.



1) Don't be an asshole. This is my favorite rule, and I am become Asshole Arbiter. Keep a civil tongue in your head and/or civil fingers on your keyboard. I recognize that this is a topic that is very contentious and very important to a lot of people, but we have to be able to work with each other. Allow me to remind you that we have been literally enslaved by a corporation in a reality separate from our own that has implanted internal shock collars inside our bodies. The attitude of your fellow enslaved are not the biggest problem here.

2) Participate in good faith. There are a few people who have not been invited to this conversation because I don't trust them to follow this rule. While I believe that having shit-stirrers around is important, I don't have the energy to wrangle them and all of you right now. If you decide that now is the time to reveal yourself as a shit-stirrer and you just want to piss people off, you will be declared an asshole and in violation of Rule 1.

3) This is a discussion to help determine what we're doing to do moving forward, not a moral debate. Obviously if you feel that killing someone is always wrong, that will inform your argument. That's fine! But if I see anyone going on about how so-and-so is naive idiot for refusing to kill or such-and-such is a monster because they do kill, I'm gonna put you in time out. Even if I agree with you! Because see Rule 1.

4) Feel free to self-moderate! I can't be everywhere at once -- in fact, there's only one of me. If you find yourself in a debate that isn't going anywhere, feel free to excuse yourself. Or even to not respond! You will not actually die if you don't get the last word in! If someone excuses themself from an exchange with you or stops responding to you, do not follow them around to continue harassing them. See again Rule 1.

5) If I freeze your thread or put you in time-out, go shitpost until you've calmed down again. Or read over what you were posting and ask yourself what was happening that I came in and put a stop to it. Or, if you feel that I am a most unfair and power-drunk bitch, you can go and make your own discussion post. Then whether or not you're in violation of Rule 1 is not my problem anymore.

Comments

Video

[googledox]

Only humans and their offshoots?

[Yes he instantly and immediately went there.]

Given that humans may not be the only lifeforms we encounter - since alternate dimensions are folding in and out of this world - it seems prudent to establish everyone's sentiments now.

Re: Video

[greyerrant]

While I have seen theoretical and one practical example of humanity's cooperation with nonhumans, it has generally led to grief. [ That was totally the fault of Erebus but he doesn't know that. ]

[hallelujahjunction]

Loken, friend o' mine, would you might could count our cooperation with some of our colleagues here - Brainiac included - as an example of cooperation between humanity and non-humans?

[Says the monsterfucker dating the Easter Bunny.]

[zerg_rush]

People can cooperate in the face of a common enemy, but that doesn't guarantee it will hold together when things get rough. That applies between humans, too.

[Kerrigan has an incredibly dim view of human (and non-human) nature, but humanity (and aliens) have earned it where she's from.]

[hallelujahjunction]

Sure, but the only guarantees in life are death and taxes. [Dan says "taxes" with more venom he's said anything else in this fraught and sensitive conversation about life and death, because sovereign citizens have great priorities.] Like you said, it applies between humans too, so there ain't no reason to discount the lives of non-humans, given that the potential for discord is universal between us all.

[zerg_rush]

I've never paid taxes.

[Because you've never engaged in any sort of commerce, Sarah.]

...Maybe on drinks a few times.

[She's very sheltered for a murderer.]

[hallelujahjunction]

[Dan nearly says "jealous!" except he's sees Kerrigan's memories and, uh, not "jealous!" actually.]

Reckon you have. They slap sales taxes on everything under the sun. That's why you can't never trust price tags, because it'll say one number and then they'll ask you for another seven percent they ain't mentioned on top.

[Dan was so distraught when he finally got the hang of reading numbers enough to understand price tags and then realized they were all lies.]

[zerg_rush]

[Kerrigan understands how a command economy works, because she's a highly-qualified military officer who can run a naval fleet if she has to, but can she make a personal budget? Hell no.]

Maybe? I don't buy a lot of stuff and adjutants handle that sort of thing for military units.

[Pause.]

Uh, adjutants are AIs.

[hallelujahjunction]

I'd put money on your AIs getting nickel-and-dimed behind the scenes. Taxes are sneaky.

[zerg_rush]

I used to work for the legal government and I don't think they tax themselves, and I'm pretty sure the Sons of Korhal gets most of its support directly from the Umojan Protectorate....

[She's not challenging Dan so much as she's working through things she never thought about before, because, frankly, no one thinks about taxes as much as sovereign citizens, including actual revenue service workers.]

[hallelujahjunction]

I don't know what any of those are, but I'm pretty sure where I'm from, even government officials got to pay sales tax, income tax and property tax. I bet you've doled out some hidden dollars back into the system in your life.

Video

[googledox]

This isn't just about the state of cooperation we have to maintain.

It's questioning whether that whatever is decided about how we should handle life and death will be evenhanded, regardless of species. Whether humans are not considered disposable but others are. Whether this "only as a final sanction" also extends to other sentients - especially when the unstable nature of this world might place us as the intruders in their dimensions, or in their own territory displaced to this dimension.

When and how we act in these complex circumstances is important, but theres also the "who" and "what" we must discuss.

Even in my universe we struggle with xenophobia between species, or robophobia, or some sentients struggle to recognize the equality of nonhumanoids, like the Durlans or the instectoid species.

There's especially risk of this in a situation where some come from worlds with hostile aliens and/or AI or none at all.

One of my best friends is an arthropod. One of my sons is an artificial intelligence who evolved to become a being of pure information and thought. It stands to reason that we may face others like them out there.

[hallelujahjunction]

You won't get no argument from me there, and I'd like to believe that the sentiment is unanimous among the group that if someone can think and feel, they're a someone, whether they're human or robot or otherwise, alive or undead, on our side or off it. But I'm aware that what I'd hope for from everyone ain't always what we get.

[Dan's daughter was a ghost; his friends are werewolves; his boyfriend is a pooka; his "one who got away" is a loch monster. When he thinks about it, for a monster hunter, he's usually bonded most tightly with non-humans.]

[greyerrant]

When we run into some non-rig based nonhostile sentients I shall be certain not to slay them, if only to keep the peace. That much I can honorably promise.

Things like those exoskeleton things with acid blood that implant eggs into humans will not received mercy. [ He's still mad about xenomorphs existing. ]

[googledox]

[Brainy understands the nature of the multiverse, how in other worlds people's xenophobic biases may be understandable - sometimes even necessary for survival, if all aliens are hostile.]

[He recognizes the concession for what it is. It's often the case that such a concession is the first step towards someone understanding there are some experiences that aren't multiversal. That there may be value unforeseen in the lives of people that drastically different from oneself.]

[Even if it never progresses past that first step, a desire to keep the peace and respect others' point of view is admirably diplomatic.]

[He inclines his head respectfully, taking the "honorably" part of the promise very seriously.]

That, we can certainly agree on. Those beings were impossible to communicate with, even if we could communicatethey would have probably been impossible to reason with, and posed an immediate and dire threat to innocent sentients.

In such a situation, you will hear no protest from me, and though I'm uncomfortable with engaging in fatal force due to my family history, you would find me at your side using it if necessary to protect sentient life.

[greyerrant]

Good.

[ The silent wolf can be curt at times, but it clearly wasn't meant as a dismissal. Sometimes a single word can suffice for agreement, and Loken is often pained by interaction with xenos, though this is hardly his first time cooperating with him, as his misadventures in the depths of the Angelicasta can attest. ]

[greyerrant]

There is a practical. I haven't tried to kill anyone yet.

[ Despite what his psycho conditioning has told him to. And he's still unsure how he's managed to keep it together around the AIs. ]

Re: Video

[googledox]

[A raise of an eyebrow, that's kind of a "I'm standing right here and working together with you all, are I?" look. His tone is dry.]

Yes, I do agree that humanity sometimes has difficulty working with others - and occasionally itself.

In my universe, that's fortunately no longer the case, but in some worlds they kidnap you, implant an internal shock collar, and use you as a slave.

[It's all about perspective.]

Re: Video

[walkingballpit]

[ Hold on there, skippy. ]

Humans and non-humans can get along without it leading it to grief. That’s a little melodramatic.

Re: Video

[wheyoftheadept]

T'be fair to Loken, it seems like in his metaplane, every single contact earth ever had with non-human life - AI, exobio, spirit, whatever - was hostile, an' not necessarily 'cause humans started it. They seem t'have a real problem with a kind of really nasty astral monster that thrives on hate and suffering, the same sort of genre of asshole I've been fighting back home, an' based on what I know of that lot, I'd believe his place is just that messed up.

[She's certain Chaos and the Horrors are the same thing, extruding themselves into different realities. It's possible, given what Horrors are, and Loken and Cain (while he was around) recognized her worst nightmares too instantly for Chaos to be anything else.

People can't be responsible for not knowing something's possible if it's been deliberately made impossible by fuckoff powerful godlike entities who don't want it to be.

Re: Video

[walkingballpit]

Okay. He also said “generally”, I know, but we have both humans and non-humans here. I just don’t want to see us getting split apart into subcategories. Even if we don’t agree 100% of the time, we’re all here under the same circumstances.

Re: Video

[wheyoftheadept]

Sure, an' if Loken had a history of going aggro at people for not bein' human that'd be one thing. If he has that history here, I ain't heard or seen anything about it, an' I don't exactly hide my pointy ears. Bein' uncomfortable with stuff bein' weird and not like home isn't the same as trynna set people against each other or divide them into groups or whatever.

Re: Video

[greyerrant]

I'm not about to abandon anyone to a situation like this, if that's what is being asked of me.

Re: Video

[walkingballpit]

Nah, I didn’t think you were saying you would. I just think we all need to be careful about us versus them language when we’re such a varied us, you know?

Re: Video

[greyerrant]

I see the merit in your statement.

[ Though it clearly rankles him to say it. ]